Dual TD12S for center speaker


  • Member
    simon5 on #6588

    No problems, we will wait for you to come back after work picks up a bit ! 8)


    Member
    simon5 on #6589

    John just told me that the TD10 dimensional is the same as AV10 but 1/4″ less depth, so you can look at the AV10 dimensional for now for reference.


    Member
    mfishmike on #6590

    Simon,

    I read some bad reports with the Arum Cantis woofers so I went with the Hi Vi 10″ Kevlar. I got them cheap with my wholesale account. From the factory, the voice coil was wired backwards in one of the drivers. Bad sign.. They are o-k, but not near the quality of the Lambdas. When work picks up I’ll order a couple of the TD10s. I’m crossed 1st order Butterworth at 450 hz for the lower bandpass corner, 1st order APC for the bandpass, and a 3800 hz cross with 3rd order Butterworth for the tweet. I went with the Davis Kevlar midrange I already had and have very few components in the crossover. It is 34″ wide with an internal cabinet for the midrange, plenty of bracing and weighs in at 95.5 lbs.[attachment=2:2p01x21v]Finishing (16).JPG[/attachment:2p01x21v]


    Member
    simon5 on #6591

    It looks real nice ! 8)

    How does it sounds like ?


    Member
    mfishmike on #6592

    Hi Simon,

    Thanks..It sounds a lot better simply due to the larger drivers being able to present more material as a center speaker, but the Hi Vi woofers are so cheesy compared to the Lambdas, thus reflected their pricing. I’m almost flat cross my -0- line with the tweet up about 2 dB so it excels in the midrange to upper frequency ranges.

    I do plan on changing them out when I can afford it. The Lambdas have served me well but the economy hasn’t.

    Thanks,
    Mike


    Member
    simon5 on #6593

    Cheesy, after seeing the color, I think of Cheez Whiz… sorry ! :mrgreen:

    2 dB of tuning, not much, very interesting, nice ! 8)


    Member
    mfishmike on #6594

    The tweet is giving me a 2 dB higher output than the the rest of the drivers and is very crisp, but not bright. I may not have made it clear.

    I’ve been searching, but don’t see the cutout for the AV10″. My existing cutout is 9″ for the cheese whiz drivers. I’ll keep searching the forums for the AV10 specs.

    UPDATE:
    Just found a post from John~~

    TD10’s:
    Mounting hole: 9-5/16″
    Countersink: 11-1/16″
    mounting depth: 5-3/4″

    TD12’s:
    Mounting hole: 11″
    Countersink: 12-5/8″
    mounting depth: 6-3/4″

    TD15’s:
    Mounting hole: 14″
    Countersink: 15-5/8″
    mounting depth: 8″


    Member
    simon5 on #6595

    @mfishmike wrote:

    I’ve been searching, but don’t see the cutout for the AV10″. My existing cutout is 9″ for the cheese whiz drivers. I’ll keep searching the forums for the AV10 specs.

    Here’s AV10 dimensional : http://www.aespeakers.com/pdfs/AV10_dimensional.pdf


    Member
    mfishmike on #6596

    Thanks Simon,

    I’ve posted the specs in my above post after I made my initial post. I found them in one of the many posts here at the forums. The TD10s is a straight drop in. My cutout is actually 10″ instead of the 9″. All I need now is some work and funding.

    Mike


    Member
    simon5 on #6597

    I know, I just posted those because you told AV10 then posted specs for TD10, so I wasn’t sure what specs you wanted, so posted them to be sure you have them all ! 8)


    Member
    mfishmike on #6598

    Simon,

    I’ve got Cheese Whiz running down my center speaker now, or at least sounds like it. The sound is audible and almost pathetic. I can’t stand not having the best like the Lambdas. I’ve always been proud that my builds use good drivers but the economy just prevented me from getting the TD10s. I’m going to email John about getting a pair.

    btw….I spent a lot of time posting some of my earlier builds with the Lambdas and the Prs. John asked me to post them. What happened to the pics? They are all gone, replaced with those nice X red empty boxes.

    Mike


    Member
    simon5 on #6599

    Glad that you want to upgrade already ! Cheez Whiz is better on toasts ! :mrgreen:
    But seriously, those Hi-Vi are that bad ? They looked like good midbass/midrange woofers… AFAIK they aren’t that cheap to buy.

    Sorry for your earlier build missing pictures. John had many problems a few months ago with the forum, someone managed to inject faulty code so he had to use a backup to restore the forum and I guess he lost your pictures. He also updated the forum to newer versions and as you can see, some emoticons didn’t like it also.

    Maybe only the links are faulty and the pics are still somewhere, I’ll try to look into it.


    Member
    mfishmike on #6600

    Yea, with my whse discount I snatched em for $90 ea. I’m using a fantastic Emotiva Supercharger 3 channel x 300 watt @ 4 ohms amplifier for my mains and center; and my receiver is the Flagship Denon 5308CI(A) which is a superior piece of equipment. The combination of the two really brings out the best, or in this case the worst in my speakers.

    I was ashamed to even order them, but so much more material is going to the center now, even with the receiver’s internal settings tweaked. The center channel has become as important as the mains for home theater use. They did come shipped in very nice boxes though! Hey, that out to be worth something. They will become another shelf stock for some kind of use in the future. For the low end DIY hobbyist using the lesser Best Buy & Frys equipment, they should satisfy the greater good, but for people like me who have ears for good quality sound and work hard to get it, these woofers aren’t much.

    They sounded great at first, but I attribute that to the fact I was hearing more music and vocals. The longer I listened to them, the more I realized that they fall very short when comparing them to the Lambdas. I first posted that I would probably have to replace them when I could afford to. I was also hearing some excellent imaging from the mains which fooled me in to thinking it sounded better than it actually does.

    I’ve got the parameters in Xover Pro 3 and did the updates a while back. Are the T/S paremeters the same in the program or have there been some changes that I need to plug in so I can make a good xover?

    Whooooo……that sub and John’s passives are broke in now and I’d put them side by side with the Wilsons XS and slap money down as to who wins out!

    Thanks Simon 8)


    Member
    mfishmike on #6601

    Simon,

    Look at my pics….I think I may have enough room for the 12TDS, just like in my mains. Looking at the cutout hole of 10″ for my cheese drivers, I may have a difficult time securing them. The mounting holes will be very close to the edge of the holes and won’t be able to hold well enough. I can get an 11″ hole cut without any problems to mount the 12s and have plenty of room to secure them. Another factor, without digging through all of my files, what is the minimum internal space I’ll need for two of the 12s; sealed. I don’t like the port noises and resonance and don’t have enough room for the passives.

    @simon5 wrote:

    Glad that you want to upgrade already ! Cheez Whiz is better on toasts ! :mrgreen:
    But seriously, those Hi-Vi are that bad ? They looked like good midbass/midrange woofers… AFAIK they aren’t that cheap to buy.

    Sorry for your earlier build missing pictures. John had many problems a few months ago with the forum, someone managed to inject faulty code so he had to use a backup to restore the forum and I guess he lost your pictures. He also updated the forum to newer versions and as you can see, some emoticons didn’t like it also.

    Maybe only the links are faulty and the pics are still somewhere, I’ll try to look into it.


    Member
    A9X on #6602

    For Q=0.707 in an unstuffed box a pair of TD12S sims out in Unibox to 85L net. F3 is 67Hz.
    Under the same conditions as above, 12H 35L 83Hz, 12M, 35L 112Hz and 12X 53L 89hz.

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